Vintage Tudor 7923 Hype and Market Speculation
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Vintage Tudor 7923 Hype and Market Speculation

By Joepny · Apr 22, 2017 · 65 replies
Joepny
WPS member · Horological Meandering forum
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Joepny initiates a critical discussion about the 'hype machine' in the watch industry, specifically addressing a blog's enthusiastic coverage of a vintage Tudor Submariner 7923. He questions the lack of balanced analysis and the potential for speculation to inflate vintage watch prices, contrasting it with the genuine camaraderie and joy of watch ownership.

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Another thought to ruminate on for this weekend while the very fun PuristS GTG in Europe is keeping us entertained with regular updates.  I thought it’d be a good juxtaposition to compare what I’d call the good vs. not-so-good sides of our hobby:  friendship/comradery & joy in ownership vs. commercialism.


Image from the internet





So the friend of watch dealers, watch blog H, ran an article today and here are snippets of the breathless writing from Ben Clymer “in true preservation class winning quality…this is an incredible, investment-grade quality…most expensive vintage Tudor to ever be sold publicly…it is often worth paying tomorrow’s price today, for the very best of the best.”  The word “incredible” is used countless times in the article.  The story is about a Tudor Submariner 7923 that sold for essentially $100K USD a few weeks ago and has now been re-listed by a major dealer for $350K USD.  I wish I was the guy putting the 7923 up for sale, wouldn’t you?  I have no objections over this listing nor the pricing. 
But what I’m shaking my head about is that Ben Clymer makes no effort to add a counter-balance and deliver any cool detached analysis to his readers.  This is my opinion and these are the thoughts that go through my head as I'm reading.  What do we know about this specific 7923’s originality without taking the dealer’s word for it?  Is it at all possible that it was put together?  And what about the nasty problem of vintage fakes with Rolex/Tudor?  Why should it be worth between $100K-$350K or possibly more than $350K?  We need more explanation from the writer for the ecstatic declaration “incredible, investment-grade quality.”  Is there a precedence or parallel that sheds more light?  Is it apparent or not that speculation is involved?  I’ll give credit that H ran a previous article that Ben Clymer links to which has some analysis to it but why did this writer not add his own take?  And I appreciate that H may not have the time & resources to address all these questions but say something directly to add balance & perspective at minimum.  It’s left to Jack Forster to add some words with perspective in the comments section.  To me, this is not how you should present well-informed information to your readers.  Yell very loudly, cheerleading the subject and then let others add counter-arguments in the comments.  No, c'mon, I want to be taken as someone slightly less dim.  smile 

Here’s some analysis that I would like to have a watch blog tackle in depth:  what is driving the vintage watch market and can we extrapolate the effect of vintage watch dealers from private individuals?  What is the impact of speculation?


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The Discussion
LO
logan2z
Apr 22, 2017

OK, I'm only (half) joking, but Hodinkee is really just a giant infomercial at this point. They have a vested interest in fueling the vintage watch price bubble as they have their own vintage watch shop. Continued collaborations with manufacturers make it clear that they are not a source of independent watch reviews/analysis. And that's all fine, but one needs to keep these things in mind while reading the 'reviews' and other articles and take them with a grain of salt.

CH
ChristianDK
Apr 22, 2017

They have a few videos where they meet some interesting collectors that are worth seeing. The rest is junk.

HO
Horologically_minded
Apr 22, 2017

You might even make a little on the side just for fun. But once it starts paying the bills, it inevitably takes on a different character. J

ES
Esharp
Apr 22, 2017

...regarding 99% of what I see on the web about watches and horology. The blogs which feature in the likes of Hodinkee's Watchville app - with one or two exceptions - post little more than puff pieces. Nothing critical, no depth; just content that might as well have been sent out wholesale by the manufacturers' PR departments. Maybe it was, in fact; I wouldn't be surprised. There are a few knowledgeable and honest writers, people like Jack Forster who you mention, but they are really few and far

AN
andrew_sg
Apr 22, 2017

are not nice. would have been better if the Tudor was bought by somebody who actually wanted to wear it.

MA
mahesh
Apr 23, 2017

I started reducing my visits to H consistently over last few months. Some watches on their vintage shops are so jacked up in price even with incomplete set it is difficult to justify the price. they have consciously shifted from a good block to a commercial online seller augmented with some focuses reviews. Best, mahesh.,

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