Independents

Play nice! Only 5 That is the challenge

All are special and unique and exciting ))
But if you had a gun to my head I would say and in no order:
Vianney Halter
Ressence
C.Klings
Urban Jurgensen Sonner
FP Journe

And I was just about to pull the trigger!!
Great choices although I must confess I am not familiar with C.Klings! I learn something new
Imagine this is the predicament the judges of the GPHG face annually during the award ceremony and for them it is a lot worse as they have to choose only one winner!

the man retired, the company still exists. There is a discussion within AHCI whether he still qualifies as a member. I am very glad you mentioned Paul Gerber, for me he is definitely on the list.
Best,
Magnus

Christiaan is a nice man like most watchmakers are.

I haven't heard about her for a while (and she is based on the same country I am in)
Is she still in the game?

her story and creations are wonderful, would it be possible to give her call and ask how she is?

Andreas makes simply crazy watches among which "The Sauterelle à Lune Perpétuelle" (the most precise phase of the moon indication ever built in a wristwatch. It made it into the Guinness Book of Records. It is also the most precise phase of the moon by some margin: Approximately 2.045 million years!) and "The Lune Exacte" (the world's most precise moon age indication : it features a new patent pending high precision moon age indication, and Andreas Strehler’s patented remontoir d’égalité.  It also happens to be the most precise phase of the moon indication ever built in a wristwatch).

This being said, needless to say that I am totally fan for Kari Voutilainen, and I also love the watches from Tim & Bart Grönefeld (their latest Remontoire just won the men's Watch award at the GPHG few weeks ago), Ludovic Ballouard or Vianney Halter.

Best,

Mike

Andreas is without doubt a living genius and could easily walk into anyone's top 5. He is extremely low profile but his work is near unparalleled.

Voutilainen, de Bethune, Journe, Strehler, Halter, Smith, Greubel Forsey

Apparently as Gruebel Forsey are now 20% owned by the Richemont Group, they are not quite independent any longer. But Strehler is an engineering marvel and De Bethune does create from outside the conventional box. I think it is quite interesting that the general conclusion is that it is pretty difficult to name just a top 5 (unless one puts a gun to Salman's head - see a few posts above). I personally have a very bad habit because ever since I was a 7 years old ( a long, long time ago ), I would rank everything from TV programmes, teachers at school, favourite subjects,friends and later on in life, memories, cars, watches, partners and ex wives. Just 'a little' over the top when it comes to statistics but I do understand that for the majority of us, it is difficult to choose one over another.

You can start by saving the dates June 16th and 17th full days ; I'll revert soon...
Best,
Mike

Because it will match quite well with our next year project...
The idea is to make 2 shots with 1 stone, I'm working on it and both are ok.
I need to finalize few details and will be able to start opening the list shortly...
Call me anytime you want this weekend and I'll debrief you
Best,
Mike

As you know we are making good progress…
dB, KV & VH
Planning on catching up with dB & KV live in January.

dB in your hands but... there might be an addition tonthe program with Romain Gauthier... stay tuned Very promising program...
In the mean time, Merry X'mas to you and yours

I would think that, even more than with traditional watchmakers, it depends on the watch itself. For instance I won't put MB&F in the 5 but I would put the Legacy Machine Perpetual in the top most interesting Independent watches today.

As usual, your reply is extensive and elaborate! Thank you very much for your views and for pointing out the strengths of the indies you have chosen. I have noticed that not many of you have chose Romain Gauthier perhaps because he is less well known, perhaps because not many realise that the finishing of his watches is almost on par with Kari V. (he did admittedly seek advice from Philip Dufour) or perhaps because others are just deemed better. I am partial to Gruebel Forsey as the technology and finishing is beyond compare, almost a case of over engineering if one compared it to a car! But thank you for at least limiting the various choices down to 5 (well almost!)
I am quite confident that I have expended my watch budget for the next few years with my recent deposits placed on the RW Smith and the Patek Philippe 5940G. For someone who will be retiring in 6 months, I think I should retire from buying watches too!
Then again my last trips to the SIHH and Basel next year will be the ultimate test of willpower!!

I love the Doble Tourbillon technique especially but when looking at the whole colelction, I would nearly like them all: the historic as well, the Contemporaine, the Invention pieces etc...

The finishing on GF is quite something plus the double and quadruple tourbillons are mind boggling. If only they were smaller and more accessible price wise! Yes, I know I am asking for a lot - wearabiliy, unparalleled finishing, accuracy and affordability! In fact because of their pricing, when we talk about independents most of us would normally 'forget' about GF!
Enjoy the SIHH Mark!. I hope to be there on 17 Jan to view in particular the new Montblanc 1858 bronze chronograph. Too big for me probably but what a gorgeous movement!

I would list in order of preference, only the ones that I would go as far as purchasing, in order of personal preference:
1. FP Journe: respect of horology in technical terms fusing innovation and tradition plus classic cases with originality achieved. Plus a real business, from the outside looking in
2. Dufour: perfect in its simplicity. Lacking the technical innovation element found in Journe, and it's not really a business. This is why it's n.2
3. Smith: somehow similar argumentation to Dufour
4. Voutilainen (although I would probably not go as far as purchase): lacks the clean/classic lines/dials of the others, but admire the talent and artistry, plus the humbleness

Thanks for the very interesting thread,
Alex

Thank you for your top 5! Or should I say Top 4!! As they are similar to mine, I would say you have excellent tastes!!
Your reasons also seem very similar to my mindset

No message body

but I think there are a handful who are at a different level in terms of movement finishing, accuracy, creativity, degree of hand made, and exclusitivity.

I would start with Kari Voutilainen, then the Groenefeld brothers, then Laurent Ferrier, then Gauthier, then Dufour.  Not necessarily in this sequence, but they are the top 5 for me. I would also tend to include Andreas Strehler in the list of the top 5, but that would make it 6 now.

They are all among the best independents in the industry today. Roger Smith seems to be less well known than the Swiss independents but for me, he is way up there due to his ethos and the way he makes his watches.

I have never seen the watches of Roger Smith live. I heard of him and saw some videos. Curious to see his watches some day live.

that Roger hardly advertises or exhibits his watches. I guess with only an annual production of 10 watches he has a long enough waiting list and does not need to market his watches. In 2020, you may see mine if you wish when I take delivery of it!

do catch the DVD 'the watchmaker's apprentice' which is a film on George Daniels and Roger Smith'. Most enjoyable surprisingly and I am quite sure that you will be hooked on Roger afterwards

In no particular order I would say Roger Smith, Thomas Prescher, Kari Voutilainen, Phillipe Dufour, Romain Gauthier.

I pick them because they are out there on their own producing fantastic pieces. I do admit that Romain is not a watchmaker but he is a visionary and has produced phenomenal watches of the highest quality.

There are a number of runners up.
McGonigle
Broussard
Marco Lange
To name a few.

All produce their own watches and don't outsource them for construction or have money behind them.

Again just my opinion.

I just knew that your top 5 would include Roger Smith and I must be on the right track if four out of our five choices are similar. Afterall not many are as well informed on independents as you are! On reflection, perhaps I should have swapped FP Journe for Andreas Strehler who is quite a creator of amazing movements. And you also mentioned a few other names which I must look up