Market
Anaroku's original post delves into a fascinating and often debated topic among Patek Philippe collectors: the market preference and higher value of Patek Philippe chronographs equipped with Lemania-based movements compared to their later, in-house counterparts. This discussion explores the technical, historical, and market-driven factors contributing to this phenomenon, offering valuable insights for both seasoned collectors and new enthusiasts.
The Patek Philippe reference 5070, part of the Complications collection, marked a significant return for the brand to large-format chronographs. Introduced in 1998, it was the first non-perpetual calendar chronograph produced by Patek Philippe since the reference 1463, which ceased production in the early 1960s. Its design drew inspiration from a unique Patek Philippe aviator's watch from the 1940s, characterized by its prominent case and dial layout, yet reinterpreted for a contemporary audience. This reference established a new aesthetic direction for the brand's chronographs, moving towards more substantial case dimensions.
The watch features a 42mm case, initially offered in 18k yellow gold, housing the manual-winding Caliber CH 27-70. This movement, based on a Nouvelle Lémania ébauche, was extensively finished and modified by Patek Philippe, meeting the brand's stringent quality standards. It provides a power reserve of approximately 55 hours. The dial, in this specific configuration, is black, protected by a sapphire crystal, and the watch is water-resistant to 30 meters. The fixed bezel frames the dial, and the watch is typically fitted with a leather strap.
Reference 5070 appeals to collectors interested in modern Patek Philippe chronographs that combine traditional movement architecture with a more contemporary case size. Its limited production run and the subsequent introduction of variants in other precious metals contribute to its collectibility. The reference represents a distinct period in Patek Philippe's chronograph history, bridging vintage inspirations with a new era of larger watch designs.
Geneva seal requires hand finishing as a final step, the PP seal is meaningless. Those would be two reasons I would strongly prefer a Lemania based Patek. Plus, the vintage and semi-vintage market is exploding and those older Pateks are often really lovely.
Does this apply also to the 5270 PP movements as well?
...I can't quantify it, but they just look better to me...
This chrono line was the first Patek chrono in 60 years or so, hence everybody jumped on it. Regarding current prices for it: speculations, same like stock market.
I find the design of the 5170 to be better done than the 5070. You can tell from the subdial positions and thicker bezel that they had to compromise on these to fit that smaller movement into the larger 42mm case. You don't get that at all with the 5170 which is clearly a more cohesive package. Some might say the PP seal doesn't mean anything but that would be like saying the Patek brand doesn't mean anything. I would say the workmanship and design process required to develop a complete in-house
The older movements were made by Lemania, a SWATCH group company. Lemania chronographs are amongst some of the renowned chronographs utilized by Vacheron Constantin, Patek Philippe, and Breguet. These movements are generally very well finished, and have a BEAUTIFUL TRADITIONAL ARCHITECTURE. There's perhaps only one major competitor to the Lemania movements, and those are the old Villeret movements from Minerva (which are much larger and designed for very large wristwatches). The Villeret and Lem
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