Patek Philippe

I have a 5070P which I love, but have become acutely aware of a couple of bits of info...

1. It is now selling at roughly the price of a 5970J (close enough to trade easily)

2. The 5970J is variously being described as a lower production model, like the 5970P. I would imagine in fact that there are similar numbers of both these 2 models made?

I am interested in your views on the long term collectability of the 2 models. I like them both enormously, but assume one will be more desirable in 10 years time than the other... Which one?

Except a Fortune Teller, nobody can tell you what model is more collectible than another.

Most important, keep or buy what you love, and " collectibility " should never be a criteria.

Would you get any watch just because it is collectible?

Did you get your 5070P because it is collectible?

Do you love the 5070P for what it is, or for what it represents?

More desirable for who?

You or the others?

Do you buy your watches according to others opinion, or just because you're in love with?

Food for thought...

Best,

Nicolas

This message has been edited by amanico on 2010-04-04 03:15:59

Yes, all those go through my mind when adding a watch to the collection.

Yes, I am interested in the opinion of others (hence why I posted on a watch forum), especially 'like-minded' watch appreciators.

Perhaps you could let me have your opinion on the relative merits of the 5070 and 5970 from your own perspective and which, if either, you would choose and why?

I'm not a regular here, my apologies for my naiivity.

Gh

As for my opinion on the 5070, I will post it this month, but I'm working since 2 weeks on the topic.

And I still need time to end it.

I may sound a bit harsh, but at the end, what only counts is what you love, because it is your money, and the watch will go on your wrist.

Now, if you do really care about what I think, I would say that I will never trade a 5070 for a 5970, being rare or not.

I don't care about rarity, as it is a subjective topic.

Is the 5070P rare?

Yes as not so many were produced, but no, if you look at all the Collectors Market, where several are available right now ( with a premium, which makes me wonder if people who got it to sell it quickly were more in love with  " easy  money " than with the watch ).

Best,

Nicolas

 

And am interested in your opinion. The 5070P is a thing of beauty - for sure, and I am proud to own it. I only managed that through a long-standing relationship with my AD and with Patek UK.

Maybe I covet too many watches, but there always seems to be a bigger fish. This is not a problem with inexhaustable funds.... but like most of us, I am not in that situation. So, when the next 'big thing of beauty' comes along, then sometimes I do choose to make sacrifices.

Thanks again for sharing your thoughts.

Gh

5070P + 5140P...

Best,

Nicolas

the 5140 defintiely is, I find it a little too small - in diameter and depth...... for me. I did look at the WG model, also strikingly good-looking. Auto is also practical, but it didn't quite resonate with me as much as the larger models...

Regards

But there is no chance at all that I would give up a 5070P for ANY 5970.

NEVER !

It is good to have an honest and very direct answer. I tend to agree with you, but recently the 5970 has played on my mind... and although I will probably keep the 5070P, I like to hear your thoughts on the matter!

thanks again

Gh

 

 

much less for a 5970j! Probably for a 5970P but he has that one too!! jijiji

I hope he enjoys them both for a long time to come...

Regards

Do not forget to bring me those wears for supper... ( ;-)
All in good spirit, always. This message has been edited by PoyFR on 2010-04-04 10:34:53

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this is ofcourse my personal opinion and like the Frech say "les gouts et les couleurs ne se discutent pas" but this platinum 5070 with it's magnificent blue dial is so much nicer than any 5970. I would like to have a 5970 and I would prefer the yellow gold, followed by white, red and platinum (the black dial makes the platinum 5970 to dark for me). I don't care which is the most rare I want the most beautifull and for me that would be the 5070P. I just LOVE simple 2 register chronographs. If my budget would allow it, I would buy several look alike watches from breguet, VC, and a bunch of other brands. 2 register chronographs are for me the most beautifull watches.

Something completely different but I saw a Longines Lindenberg a few days ago which had the same dial layout and I loved it from the first second I saw it.

Now, how can something look better than this

 

 

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it goes right to the heart of why each of us collects watches.  Some do it for investment. Some do it for passion. Some do it because of the engineering miracle that is a watch. The list of "why" we collect is diverse and highly subjective. There is no question that each of us has a virtually unique list of factors that contribute towards what makes us buy a watch. I am not sure there is a right or a wrong actually. For me, there has to be a combination of factors that make me want something. I have a list of rules that lead me to buy a watch. 7 rules. The first 6 rules are all quite logical. For example, one of the factors that makes me like a watch is its historical rarity. I get a tremendous kick out of owning a rare watch. It adds to my enjoyment, but it is only one factor of the 7 rules. The most important rule however is Rule No. 7, which goes like this:

 

Rule no. 7: If a watch has passed none of the previous 6 rules, but you are still in love with it, then buy it.

 

On the 5070P, i will give you my highly subjective view. Of all the watches i own, the last one that I would ever sell is a JLC that is worth no more than £2000. The next last would be my 5070P. I think it is the most beautiful watch I have ever worn. I also own the 5970P which is almost certainly rarer and potentially a better "investment". But i would sell it well before either my JLC or 5070P and that is because the 5070P has "soul". It calls to me. It wants me to wear it. It speaks. It has character. Simply put, I love it. Now, is it more collectible than a patent pending Rolex or a Comex or a 5970P/G or whatever? I actually don't care. It has to be how it makes you feel.

 

Hope that makes sense.

Joe, you said

"The next last would be my 5070P. I think it is the most beautiful watch I have ever worn. I also own the 5970P which is almost certainly rarer and potentially a better "investment""

 

I  have a feeling you might be wrong here. This is difficult because it's not much appreciated when we talk about the value. but ...

I have a VERY good relationship with my AD and I can tell you my AD got 2 5970P and only 1 5070P so I'm not sure there are less 5970 than 5070. But like said I don't care which of the 2 is the most rare. And about the value or the 'investment value' censored I can buy you quite a few 5970 at list or maximum 10-15% above list, I don't think it is possible to find a 5070P if you don't want to pay 30% or more above list ( In EURO !!)

 

You may be right. Both are 1yr productions, but i assumed (possibly icorrectly) that a grand complication would have lower production planned than a simple complication watch. I do wonder whether many 5970P watches were ordered at the height of the housing boom and "delivered" amidst the bust, so many who ordered them would have had to come up with money that didn't materialise...hence many more up for sale. I have no basis to argue either way, and i concede that 5070P may easily be harder to find.

because of your experience with women while wearing it, it just went up a notch on the 'keep-ometer'...

women find me irresistible when i wear the 5070P, whereas with the 5970P its more mixed.

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Buy the watch that makes you happy first, the rest is luck >

Personally I never bought a watch because others valued it, loved it or because it was first a good investment. 

 

A watch or anything else you buy for yourself is before anything else a representation of your values, sentiments and likings, if you buy any watch for any other reasons first then you either have vested interests or you are simply a ‘victim’.

 

Of course we are not all capable to envision the future of a purchase, but we often buy with knowledge and criteria, this can later help to be happier with the outcome of our choices, however in general it our choices that matters most because a regardless the later outcomes, it is you, me and the others that will end up bringing that much more extra values to our wears, by loving them, by respecting them, by learning about them, by understanding them, by discussing about them, and by sooner or later being able to speak about them, that alone makes many others liking what you like…

 

Anyway, I do like the 5970 (P) because to me it is not a cluttered dial, the dial colour is magnificent and because the 5070 has a presence on wrist that often leaves me with no choices but to admiring it.  I prefer the 5070 G because I have a choice of strap without ending with 3 colours, otherwise I would take the 5070 J because with a black strap (Black strap are to me easier to wear often) the watch on wrist will have 2 colours only.  But that 5070 P is gorgeous for sure.

 

I will not go for a 5970 because my choice was the Vacheron Constantin 47212, it offers me better readability and a better size for my wrist.

 

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What number is yours?!

 

This watch, again very personal, is THE most wonderful and gorgeous watch ever made and I wanted it the second I saw it - no doubts, quibbles or rational thoughts at all... I just had to have it.

Mine is number 2, by the way.

I buy watches because I like them regardless of future value....

Now if they end up being valuable, all the better....

There is a perfect example...
When the Paul Newman Daytona was available for sale in the 70s for less than 500 Euros nobody would buy it...
Now, a good condition one is about 85,000 Euros....

So... you never know what the market will do in the future....

Personally I love the 5070.... I am considering it but would not trade my favourite watch for it....

But which of the two do you love?
Go with your gut feeling and then you will enjoy your watch more...

Cheers

I think we have similar thoughts on the issue... I love the 5070P, for sure and like so many others here, I can't see me letting it go - all the while I don't need to.

Thanks

 

IMHO this is the most beautiful watch made.  Like some of the other sentiments, I also love the "simplicity" of the 2 register chrono.

If you could trade even for 5970G or 5970P, this would be more difficult call for me than 5970J (the relative rarity of the J is no added bonus IMO).

I do agree there is something unmatched and magical about the 5070P.