Patek Philippe

what are your true feelings of each of them ?  5270 vs 5970, 5170 vs 5070, 5496 vs 5050.  Is Patek running out of new ideas ??  Putting more stones on a 5960 which becomes 5961. So, i suppose we are going to see a 5271 with more stones on the case ?? 

what is even more amazing to me, is the dramatic price increase, certainly inflation cannot be the thing to blame.  When Patek first introduced 5070 and 5970, i dont remember prices being that high.   today, collectors from around the world cannot truly enjoy this brand as its prices has reached a point, where ordinary collectors can only dream of. 

am i the only person getting this feeling ?  patek obviously doesnt think that way. 

do you notice, there are actually more minute repeaters on their list, so call " grand complications " than simple watches.  does that make sense ?  surely, the watchmakers are also feeling the pinch, if patek is true with their production numbers, by increasing the number of watches needed to be ordered in order to obtain, does it help their watchmakers in the factory with their work load ? is that the ticket ? 

what happen to the good ole days, where a few models will be introduced to replace the old ones, but that period of time, took over ten years to reach that point ??  2499 was introduced in the 50's , it took over 30 years before being replaced by 3970, which also stayed on the shelf for another 20 years before being replaced by 5970.  all of a sudden, new models are coming out faster than we can say " wah ".

we see extrodinary models being introduced this year, but i feel, patek is leaving their traditional look, and entering into more creative designs.  is that what collectors from around the world are requesting ?? 

therefore, i ask of you, what are your feelings towards patek's creations this year, what is going to happen in a short span of another 2-3 years ??

thank you

The 5170 leaves me cold. I thought about buying it as a lover of chronos but after looking at it and comparing it to the 5070, I declined two offers. The 5270 is nice but its dial also leaves me less than enthused when compared to the 3970 and 5970. It seems more like a morphing of Patek and an ALS. I am just glad that I had the chance to acquire the 5070 and 5970 as PP on its current path of ever increasing price, outrageous pricing relative to other brands, and ho-hum designs, may be losing me as a customer. Is it Thierry Stern's leadership that is responsible for this movement away from its roots? While I do not know for sure, it does seem to coincide with his ascendancy to PP!

After the 5270 came out, and I found out the pricing, I have been focusing on the older models still available in the grey market and at auction, etc. as those designs have an elegance that I don't find in the current collection of chronos.

"what is even more amazing to me, is the dramatic price increase, certainly inflation cannot be the thing to blame"

 

No, not the inflation but the weakness of the euro and even worse, the weakness of the USD

 

EURO - CHF ---> the euro dropped almost 20% in 2 years

 

USD - CHF --> USD dropped almost 25-30%

 

 

 

Than also know that the price of gold , EVEN IN CHF went up about 30% in 2 years (I said in CHF because in Euro and USD it is more because of currency)

Also add 3 till 5% inflation in the last 2 years

 

I know, I don't like to pay 30% extra but you can't blame Patek. Rolex had the same increase the last 2 years

And if you're from the US, at the end of the mont you can expect another increase

 

 

 

poor business practice and a whole lot more ;-)  If the watch industry wishes to act in such a self-serving manner, they have no right not delivering total customer satiety, regardless of cost to them. They should also expect sales to show extreme customer discretion.

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Richard.

will this become a permanent Euro and USD rise? I am affraid it will be the latter as I have never seen a price reduction... So in my view strongly increasing prices when the currency is against you but not lowering prices when the currency is working in your favour is just opportunistic behaviour in my view...

take the new 5270 ... gorgeous but expensive. Listprice is 125K euro !

Imagine you buy one when they will become available

Now, what if for some reason the CHF would loose 20% compared with the EURO ....

How would you feel if your watch was now for sale at your AD for 100K, would't you be very p*ssed ? I mean, you would have paid 25K too much

Imo the only thing they can do (if the CHF would loose value against the euro and USD) is having no increase in EUR/USD for a couple of years

The latest offerings, while technically impressive, are pieces that only a very select few will ever see and still fewer, ever be allowed to purchase. The application process certainly has pushed many (very qualified folks) away by being denied the purchase of some of these models to other brands or to other indulgences. Yet, they continue to dangle the apple to the world in ever increasing numbers of new models.

If you look at the catalogs over the past 10 years, the number of super complicated pieces now occupy as much space given to the rest of the product line. It seems very clear that these pieces have made news in the press and helped to ensure their status as the top watch brand for the foreseeable future and I wouldn't expect this trend to end anytime soon. But, every party will come to an end at some point.

The pursuit of introducing some new complication or adding existing complications to existing designs will prove successful for a while but neglecting basic watch design and production, not to mention the pressure of the current and forthcoming new price levels, may result in many folks losing interest in spending this type of money and look elsewhere. For years watches never enjoyed the popularity they have recently experienced, but there is no reason that it could not to change again.

I read the interview with Philippe Dufour and it was quite impressive regarding his philosophy of watchmaking and maintaining it as an art form with little regard for financial rewards. Years ago, I felt Patek shared the same philosophy and had that special feeling when I got my first Patek, but now ... I don't. To me, their center of gravity has changed in the very recent years. Don't get me wrong, I still love my Pateks but it isn't quite the same now as it once was. And I concur with another's post regarding the thoughts of buying more vintage pieces when that philosophy seemed to exist at Patek.

There is a saying, "Success has made failures of many men" and when I read your post, unfortunately this came to mind. I do wish that they would focus more attention on again building great watches as they did in the past and let the worldwide market determine their place within the industry rather than the press or marketing.

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Maybe it's just me, or maybe the price increases, or whatever, but for the first time in my brief history of watch collecting, I have little interest in the new Pateks. The ones to have are not really obtainable any longer except to a very small group.

And the "advancements" such as the new chrono movements (both the auto and manual) leave me a little empty. The winding crown and chrono buttons have little feel. The aesthetic design of the 5170 does little for me compared to the 5070.

As prices go up and up, without the appeal of the watches keeping pace, we will see things like a new Patek manual chrono sitting in the AD case for weeks or more, as I have been amazed to see.

To be fair, I still love Patek, but I have felt my interest in the new pieces waning (which is not good news overall with yet another price increase looming).

I've been a loyalist for 15 years, and for once, I feel the same sentiment as you do.  I hope PP is reading this, since we are the customers who have been loyal for such a long time, not the newbie who have learned about the brand and the price gains recently as an attraction to buy a PP.