Horological Meandering

Hi everyone, I am new to the site, I know this is a common question but it is new to me. Is a tourbillon worth the money? I can't afford it so I am going to say that they are not worth it. I mean the difference in price in a watch with a tourbillon from a watch without one is ridiculous. But I guess the super rich do need something to distinguish themselves. What do you more experienced horological aficiandos have to say?

...would probably say 'this is not the best place to talk of price, or cost'

Welcome!

Only you can say what a thing is worth - to you. A car, a house, a piece of jewellery, a tourbillon, a painting. We here can share your appreciation of it, regardless of it's worth.

Look forward to reading more of your posts.

Cheers,
pplater.

Still learning the culture on this site. I love it. It's nice to connect to people who love watches as much as I do! I guess in the future I would like to add at least one tourbillon to the collection!

Cheers Samgame

Is Quartz watch worth it when you can have Time for free ( with your cell phone )?

Is poetry better than a good pizza ( even if Pizzas may sometimes reach Poetry )?

It is all about passion.

Best,

Nicolas

This message has been edited by amanico on 2011-02-27 04:02:29

Hi amanico, I think I am going to have to agree with you. I would definitely want a tourbillon to add to my collection. It's all about love and passion of our favorite hobby!

is to have a good pizza while listening to good poetry.  Now ohers have argued the point, but I still say one sounds foolish attempting to recite poetry while eating good pizza, even if it is one's own poetry.  Reading good poetry is of course easily achieved while eating a good pizza, but poetry must be heard aloud. 

What a fantastic allusion you bring us, Nicolas.  For was it not the great bard himself who penned:

For fine pizza pie rememb'red such wealth brings
   That then I scorn to change how my repeater sings!

All my very best,

CaliforniaJed (with poetry in the head!)
 

and see if I can get the kids to read me some poetry.

You see I usually eat pizza on Sinday evenings with the kids.

We will see if poetry and kids that like pizza mix.

Best regards,

George

. . . OMOS", right? . . .

No message body

I believe that this mechanical wonders still are very expensive, but because of the little pieces annually made this make them really unique. But as the modern times goes by, and every One of us get's like atomical watches on our cells phones, compotera, ect, the mechanical watches industries will have like a second crises really soon. So buy One tourbillon whole you can, because gneis prive will go up again.

Truly Epic

LOL!

J

No message body

If you like some thing enough youll always find a way to justify its price.

regards
Marwan

For me it is very simple: I can't really see what kind of real benefits tourbillon could offer and even I had times when I could easily afford buying one, I did not.

At the same time, nobody needs a minute repeater and still I am considering saving money to get one. I even know already which one. I have been discussing with many watchmaker I respect a lot about the complications. None of them have been crazy about tourbillons and at the same time all of them dream about minute repeaters.

I have no idea why the premium for having a tourbillion is so high. At the same time as an economist I understand that the manufacturers must generate profits. And it is very simple: if somebody is prepared to pay for a tourbillion, that's just great. However, the mambers here are not very often presenting their toubillions.

Best, Kari

Tourbillons do look nice! They definitely get the wow factor. When I see someone with a watch with a tourbillon I have to say wow. It is a beautiful complication!

The dual-triaxial versions have a much better chance when they come forth from someone like Thomas Prescher.

The omni-axial from JLC - the highly touted Gyro I - which I actually tried on and found to be boring, and slso mixed together with the other compicated distractions.

On the other hand, the Haldimanns are - very beautiful - "sinnlos aber schön" - meaningless in a strictly technical context - but beautiful!!

As for Gruebel & Forsey, these are incredible mechanical works - no doubt whatsoever about that - and with finishing that (may) be worth their inaccessible price.

Somehow I prefer the PP tourbillons with an (optional!) solid back - nothing there to see at all. But no oils to dry out through UV bombardment which may require servicing after half a year.

Why cut a huge hole in the dial face just to see something swirling, and always in the same direction?

Enjoy it as long as you can - especially before buying one!

Regards,

amerix

This message has been edited by amerix on 2011-02-27 08:55:50

but in pieces such as the Journe tourbillons, the Haldimann watches or the Laurent Ferrier watch I think they are fantastic examples of the watchmaker's craft.

Best

Andreas

from what i've read here and elsewhere i would say that a tourbillon on a wristwatch makes no difference to the accuracy of it whatsoever. it was designed for a pocketwatch which sat in one position for most of the day and it certainly improved their accuracy, but a wristwatch moves 1000's of times a day so doesnt need an aid to positional error, however, a tourbillon does show the skill of the watchmaker as they are hard to make so although it wont make your watch more efficient it will show that the company/person making it have a skillful team.

is it worth the extra money for the extra skill and detail ?  quite probably.

are there too many watches with tourbillons on them just for the sake of it ?  without a doubt.

do they improve the look of the watch ?   usually yes.

 

i think they are the more important questions rather than the price. if you want a tourbillon without paying over the odds you can buy a chinese made one which, although it doesnt have the finish of others, is still a fully functioning complication.

when you get into buying high end watches it is hard to escape a tourbillon as so many of the new modern pieces have them.

at the end of the day it is for you to decide whether its worth it financially, but as far as timekeeping goes, i dont think it is.

best

Graham

Thanks Graham, great answer! I'm learning something new everyday.

As a time keeping quality device? No.
For the esthetics? Your call.
Spring drive and quartz render it obsolete in a fashion, but if I had the money and the inclination, I would consider strongly.
They can be beautiful.

Is platinum worth the premium?

Are Independents worth the premium?

Watch collecting is a very personal thing so different people put a different price for different features. I might be willing to pay $10k more for platinum but not willing to spend $5k extra for an enamel dial. Or I may be willing to pay $30k more for a chronograph but not $5k for a moonphase.

You could even extend that question to: Are watches worth the money? We all have mobile phones these days.

I guess the most important thing is, are tourbillons worth the money to YOU?

Welcome to the community!

who has been pondering the same question for some time.

fernando

I spend about 1 to 2 hours a day on this site, on average. I love watches and it will be a way of life forever for me. Hobbies have come and gone but my interest in watches and clocks has grown stronger everyday. I live in Oregon and here there are not many what I can say "fine" watch boutiques so I have never seen an RM, Journe, AP, or most any of these brands here in person but I will one day. Anyway at a grand opening of our new college basketball arena about 3 weeks ago it happened. I was walking and looking at everyones watch like I do and there it was. An A Lange & Sohne RL Tourbillon in rose gold. The gentleman took it off and even let me hold it. I must say the tourbillons are a lot smaller than I ever thought, I am used to seen macro shots and I was amazed that the size I thought these watches were, were not. They are actually much much smaller and I was amazed. I have new respect for them because the size is so small that it must be very hard to do. Is it worth it? 3 or 4 years ago I would have laughed and said no way. The more I got into watches and appreciate them and the craftsmanship I say it is worth every penny.

It is all subjective, a kia will get you to the same place as a Ferrari so why pay a premium of 20 or 30 times, I guess when it is not all about getting from point A to point B. Or just telling time.

Hello Samgame,

I have been enjoying the responses of other PuristS to your question. It is clear to me that the 'value' in a Tourbillon, and indeed any complication, is a very personal thing. And it depends on your priorities. I value the historical links all the way back to A.L. Breguet, I enjoy the mechanical complexity that the Tourbillon brings to the escapement and I value the watchmaking prowess required to assemble an escapement that uses dozens, if not hundreds, of parts and weighs only a few ounces. If it brings additional chronometry to the watch then that's a bonus, but I am content as long as it does not make it worse. I enjoy seeing a Tourbillon dancing on the front of the dial, but I understand the allure of a more discreet configuration.

Gosh, I think it's time we had a Tourbillon photo thread, because tourbillons are less about words and more about emotion. Along the lines of tasting the perfect pizza (thanks Nico!) or seeing the perfect piece of art.

Modern lubricants dried up in 6 months, Amery? That sounds a bit alarmist to me, my friend.

And finally, like many other things in life, it's not what you have, but how you use it! A mass produced Tourbillon just plonked into a watch to increase profits is not attractive to me and not what this is about. Combined with other things such as interesting dials, innovative displays, remontoirs, chain and fusee, or even a repeater or Sonnerie brings the watch to the level of magic. Control over time, gravity and space.

So, perhaps perfectly useless in a wristwatch that assumes multiple positions on the wrist each day, but beautifully poetic mechanical toys, full of emotion and perfectly exemplifying why we love mechanical watches.

Kind regards from La La Land,

Andrew

I read this a while ago in a German magazine interviewing someone high in the technical division at Patek Philippe. I'll try delving into my stacks of periodicals to discover his name, rank and exactly how he was cited.

The argument at PP for not putting a tourbillon up front is that certain oils in it will break down or deterioriate after that time with sufficient (excessive?) exposure to the UV perhaps combined with the heat from sunlight. That is one of the reasons that PP only allows their tourbillons to be viewed from the back, as a concession to the customer. They would prefer a solid back! However, that is available as an option for certain, if not all, models.

Perhaps someone could ask Laurent Ferrier - surely he would know - or the Patek Philippe Forum here.

Regards,
Amery
This message has been edited by amerix on 2011-02-28 00:38:40

at a site called

wwp.greenwichmeantime.com

in an article about the PP Ten Day Tourbillon 5101

" ... The oil needed to lubricate the tourbillon can decompose when exposed to ultraviolet radiation and therefore, it could lose its beneficial tribological properties within a matter of months. The consequences would be friction, wear, and a degradation of the rate accuracy of the watch. This is certainly not a tolerable fate for a timepiece designed for superior precision. Hence, Patek Philippe prefers not to expose tourbillons to direct sunlight through an aperture in the dial..."

Hope it is OK to mention this, if not please edit out.

Regards,
Amery

The catalogue states the same.

Personally unless a tourbillon improves the accuracy of the watch it is completely pointless and has no value to me.  If it has no impression on accuracy I'd rather have an automaton on the watch face as it would be more entertaining.  An exception would be made for the JLC Gyrotourbillons - these are poetry in motion. 

I like the Patek approach to tourbillons in that the timing requirments are stricter than a regular escapement and the fact it's only visible from the back to preserve the timekeeping integrity.

I also tend to think that visible tourbillons are a bit flash.

that was what PP had told me when I asked about their tourbillons....



Cheers