Omega

This Omega bug has bitten me hard! I posted about a Speedmaster last week and finally pulled the trigger on one - an Apollo XI 20th Anniversary Edition. I am still waiting for it to arrive as I type this but am now looking to get a dive watch.

I saw this SHOM 200m but know nothing about it. I just want to get the expert opinion of the gentlemen on this forum. I only know the Ploprof but the vintage is already out of my budget so I am thinking of this beauty.

Can anyone give me a background on these watches? Collectible/desirable?

The seller claims that it is NOS and that it was manufactured by SHOM (not Omega)?

Is this possible?

Is it worth the almost $3k the seller is asking?

Their website is in French which I understand some, and it doesn't look like it's available in English.  Anyway, I'm wondering if it was manufactured by Omega for SHOM or vice-versa or in conjunction with?  Reminds me of Comex and Rolex, and the French Navy Divers and their association with Rolex Subs, and I think they had input to the custom design by Rolex (Rolex experts, please correct me, thanks).

This Seamaster is awesome!  Nice pic, nice watch.  I like the design better than the PloProf, it looks more 'wearable' on the wrist.  Case diameter?  Movement?  Speedys are classic, but besides Subs and the like, the Seamaster 300m and Planet Ocean and similar are real tanks, great in almost any environment.  Give me screw-down crowns and watertight cases anytime.

Thanks!   =:^D

it is a 43mm x 49mm - not sure if he included the crown in this measurement.
movement of the lefty is a cal. 1002 as opposed to the cal. 1010 or 1012 for the right hand version

Hi Onfivezero...


Your comment  "movement of the lefty is a cal. 1002 as opposed to the cal. 1010 or 1012 for the right hand version"

The 1002 was used in the 600m diver..  with the crown opposing the date window ( crown at 9 and date at 3 o'clock position).  Due to the  fact that a date wheel is asymmetrical ( 31 days) you need a different date wheel depending on the orientation of the crown position.  Depending on the case ref the 600m has a date wheel for a crown at 9 and the date window at 3 .  The 1002 can use 101x date wheel that has  the other orientation crown at 3 and the datewindow at three.

Another point the dial feet on the 1002 and 101x are ( in a straight line in opposite locations so it can be "flipped" without modification.

This means the following for the 600 m watch collector .. there is no uncommon date orientation version , the watch maker just used a std datewheel from a 101x .


This also means your comment "movement of the lefty is a cal. 1002 as opposed to the cal. 1010 or 1012 for the right hand version"


Can I ask where you got the above info ?  Maybe  I am incorrect but I would like to compare notes to whoever has this opposing view..


Looking forward to seeing your Speedy..

Good Hunting

Bill Sohne

hi bill,

all that movement information was passed on to me by the seller.
i know nothing about omega movements as i am new to the brand.

should this raise some flags?

cheers,

jay

Hi  jay
No flags raised.  I just disagree with the seller. Let me ask a question, is the seller stating that he or she is an expert on this watch ?

Best

Bill

bill,

the seller didn't express to me that he was an omega expert.
he seems to carry many vintage obscure brands on his website.

i guess he got the information from the person he sourced the watches from?

please let me know what questions i should ask him to make sure everything is legit.

best,

jay

I knew another Omega Seamaster made for the SHOM, as well as a JLC from ( I guess ) the Fifties.

I'm hunting the JLC, but now that I see this one ( I didn't know ), I may also add this one too, in my wish list.

I much prefer it to the Ploprof, iwth its less extravagant case.

These watches with a story are really cool, indeed.

If you don't already own it, you'd better go for it!

It is not a matter of collectionability, just the fact that there is a Story behind this very nice watch, IMO.

Do you have a pic of the case back?

Best,

Nicolas

i could be wrong about this as there is very little information about it, but its a classic collectable Omega 200m divers from the 70's made for a specialist diving organisation. lovely piece.

best

Graham

Nicolas, Here is a pic of the caseback.

According to the seller, the watch is NOS from Omega. They were only assembled recently as this model was made in the 70's for the French government but they only took delivery of a handful before switching to Auricoste, leaving Omega with lots of inventory. They only started releasing them about 2 years ago.

The correct version of the watch has black hands. I have a choice between the 2, but I seem to like the more "Ploprofy" look of the orange. I just ordered a set of the original black with the watch to make it correct in the future if I choose to do so. Here's a picture of the correct black hands version.

Coming from the SHOM, with special engravings " SH + a number ".

I also saw these engravings on a JLC.

As for the Seamaster coming from the SHOM, you can have a loo at the boo Omegamania, page 253.

The book says that the watch was sold on September, 26, 1977.

The case is not the same than yours, actually.

It is very interesting!

Thanks for the pics.

Best,

Nicolas

nicolas,

i was not able to see the caseback of the omegamania SM 200m SHOM as i don't have a copy of the antiquorum catalog.
the website only shows a front picture.
i'm assuming that there is no SHOM stamp on this one because they were never delivered to SHOM by Omega?

the watch is not mine yet.
i have struck a deal with the seller and i will wire him the payment on tuesday.
i am just worried that it is a watch that was assembled with NOS Omega parts but has no real model or designation.
the case could be home made?
although the dealer is quite reputable and has a website although i've never dealt with him before.
this is the main reason i wanted to get expert opinions from the forum.

jay

I'm not expert on Vintage Omegas, but when it comes to watches that supposely have an History, I'm very prudent, and in case of doubts, I always pass on them.

If someone here can make a scan on the Omegamania page in question, it will be very helpful.

The SHOM 2OO meters has a different case and dial than yours...

And the few SHOM watches I saw had the engraving on the case back...

Let's see what the others think.

Best,

Nicolas

I've seen more than a handfull on Ebay recently... Interesting but I found the prices too high for a gamble...

Anybody with more info?

Cheers, D

Nicolas, Dino and Graham,

Thanks for all your input gentlemen!

Fleabay is where I saw it and corresponded with the seller.
He has a website and sells a bunch of other NOS dive watches as well.

What pertinent questions should I ask him?

I don't really care about the SHOM affiliation, I like the watch because it looks like a baby ploprof.
Being a SHOM watch would be nice though as I would never be able to buy a Comex sub but it isn't really a deal breaker.
I am just wondering if the price should be adjusted since if there is no affiliation?

Jay

The ref is ST 166.0177, available as international collection b/w 1974-1978. Movement is caliber 1012, 23 jewels.

No connection to SHOM to my knowing. 

The on featured in your pic is having its crown in the wrong position, it should at the right hand side of the watch at 3 o'clock position instead of 9 .

IMHO, the 70's Omega diving watches are more appealing in the way that their appearances are very retro. Most popular one is of course the Ploprof with water resistance up to 600m. This is due to its unique case design. The rest of the line are 120m, 200m and 1000m which are less featured ( dont know why)

I think you got it wrong with the seller claiming this watch is Omega NOS. I think it could be a case of the watch being send back to Omega for an overhaul and they decided to change the hands with NOS. Perhaps you may want to verify this?

I'm offering my 2cts worth here. If you are really into watch collection, then it doesnt matter what price you paid as long as it's within your budget. It all depends on the timing.

However, if you are buying it just hoping that it can change hands with a higher value than what you had paid, I strongly discourage the idea as it can be quite painful.

Good luck with whatever your decision...

 

 

I was able to find more info on the web using the reference number you supplied!
Came across some forum threads from 2005 and a french website as well.
It seems that the watch is legit.
Not sure about the "destro" version though....
The seller informed me that the hands are not to spec as they are Ploprof hands.
He will supply me with a set of Original hands as well should I decide to change them back later on.

As for the price, the only reason I ask is because I have not seen any of these change hands so I don't know what the market price for it is.
Yes, I really like the watch and it falls into my budget but that is not the point.

All the best,

Jay

Graham,

After googling the ref number, I found the watch on the Omega website.
It does exist, but it doesn't show a destro model.
If it is a non-factory conversion, I don't really mind as it probably would be easy to put back to the regular configuration.
Plus, the destro model will be more comfortalbe to wear as the huge crown won't dig into my hand as I have a very small (6.5") wrist.

Regarding the price, I do understand that used pieces are hard to value as they depend on many many factors.
I just wanted to find a range so I know what I am getting myself into.

With the reference number supplied by hhk2, I was able to find a similar watch sold at the Antiquorum May 2009 New York auction.
The watch was a regular right version with the correct hands on a mesh bracelet as well.
It sold for $1,080 including the buyers premium.
Now, it seems that the $2,900 for this watch is a bit high.
Will dig a bit deeper and keep you guys posted.

Best,

Jay

that upon doing my Omega research on google, I found that there are places on the net that sell brand new Omega parts - bracelets, dials, hands, movements, and even cases!
they had everything for speedmasters... even a snoopy dial.
this totally surprised me as you would never be able to buy a brand new Rolex case from a watch parts dealer.

I guess, it is totally possible to assemble an Omega out of brand new parts and label it NOS.

"I guess, it is totally possible to assemble an Omega out of brand new parts and label it NOS."

Not only is it possible, but a very well known seller from the world's smallest continent does it all the time.

Be wary of the "NOS" moniker.  This is often used to describe two different kinds of products: 1) Those which were originally manufactured at the time of the production run, but remained unsold/unused or 2) Those which are newly manufactured OEM replacement parts for out of production models.

You can decide how you feel about either option, but you should be aware of which it is as the value of the former is usually greater than that of the latter.

There has been some debate about how much of a SHOM connection these models really had.  I certainly don't think that the provenance is as strong as, say, the COMEX Subs, which have a well-documented history and are labeled as such.  So, as was said earlier, decide whether you like the watch on its own merit.

Either way, an attractive piece (at least in my opinion)

Cheers,
Alex

Hi 150

Unfortunately I have also seen from sellers on the "flebay", that they had more or less all parts for several Rolex' including subs and daytos, for your own assembly line at home...

That said, I have also been watching these really nice SHOM 200, especially the one with the meshed bracelet. Left or right I dont really care. But a more pretty watch than the PloProf. So I am very anxius to find out more about the watch (as you are) before I purchase.

Many selling the watch claims it is produced for the SHOM in 1973-1974 and that the watch uses the calibre 1010 for the left  and the calibre 1012 for the right hand version. I found reference 166.0177 (1974) as stated as a right  hand version, whereas Omega reference this to a left hand version (and no right hand versions should exist..).

I have also tried to find any links between SHOM and Omega without any success....

BR and good luck!

Hans

Just like you, I have not been able to find a clear connection between the SM200 and SHOM.
I did find the 166.0177 in the Omega Vintage website and the watch does exist.
There are a few other posts on other web forums that show it as well.
All of them refer to it as a SHOM watch.
I also like it better than the Ploprof as I have a small wrist.

Best regards,

Jay

Hi Jay

I am looking forward to seeing pictures of your watch (I understood you have or will purchase it?) and if you eventually are opeing the watch, what reference No. is on the case back. Would be interesting to confront Omega with this mmhh.

Good luck to you ;-)

BR Hans

I have decided to purchase the watch but it is not with me yet. I did get a photo of the movement from the seller. He also confirmed that the caseback is stamped 166.0177.

Hi Jay

Good stuff
I am happy on your behalf

I am really looking to seeing your pictures of the watch and on your wrist and some comments. To get closer to this mistery...!
Have you thought about asking Omega for the providence of the watch...?

Best regards
Hans

Wauw I instantly liked the watch and find it interesting that not many have it. So I put a bid on it too without knowing much - then I found this site and it seems I'm paying too much... What did you get it for and is it SHOM?

Hi Guys,

Sorry to dig up such an old thread but I recently stumbled upon  a "Mint" SHOM and found that all your input are really helpful.

My most sincere thanks to all those who have contributed.

I first fell in Love with the Ploprof but since my wrist is not big enough for it. I gave up on the idea.

This Baby Ploprof re-ignited the flame in me but there are a few things I'm concerned about:

1) I was under the impression that SHOM only comes in Destro models

2) How is it something this old can still look so "mint"

3) The part as some of you mentioned that different parts of an Omega watch can be "assembled" into the final product would make this watch... An unoffical product of Omega?

I'm not a serious collector and I rotate all my watches for wear. Most of my (shallow) purchases are based on the asthetics of the watch.