Omega

Hello all,

Please someone explain to me the meaning of the caliber: 30T2SC or correct what I think I already know about this Omega caliber code. 

30 indicates the movement size of 30mm.
T2 indicates some form of going barrel???
And SC indicates the Secondhand is Centered on the dial.

What exactly is T2 vs T1 vs T3?

Explanations appreciated. and kindly excepted. 

Sharky409

Hello

T1 T2 and T3 refers to the variation/type  of the caliber:

30           15J 1939
30T1       15J 1941
30T2       15J 1941
30SCT1  17J 1941
30SCT2  17J 1941
30T2 PC AM (Cal 260)      15J 1943
30T2 PC AM (Cal 261)      15J 1943
30T2 RG (Cal 262)            17J 1943
30T3 PC AM (Cal 265)      15J 1949
30T3 PC AM (Cal 266)      17J 1950
30T2 SC PC AM (Cal280) 17J 1943
30T2 SC RG (Cal 281)      17J 1947
30T3 SC PC AM (Cal283) 17J 1950

where:

AM means anti-magnetic
PC means shock-protected
SC means center seconds
RG means special regulating (chronometer)

BWs
Franco

PS:  the names 26X and 28X where in fact used from 1949, so calibers produced before 1949 have the extended (30T etc ) name printed on the mainplate below the balance wheel,  those after 1949 have 26X or 28X it printed on the front plate.  All furniture Omega I have seen have the post-1949 names.
This message has been edited by Franco on 2011-04-17 11:29:46

... can be fournd in the Marco Richon book "A journey through time" :

Sounds like an interesting book, but if I don't find it at the public library I probably won't be reading it any time soon.  Of course, I could maybe make a trip to Bienne? Or I could win the lottery. Thanks again to all for the information.  Cheers!

Sharky

Opened 30T2 SC Ref. 2179 today (I hope I properly id this wristwatch).
Looks great.  Having it cleaned, oil, & adjusted.
Found inside:

mvt # 10.340.028
16J
case # 2179-4

According to a mvt # chart I found online this mvt # means the manufacture date is 1944.  Is  this correct?  Unfortunately I did not see any info. on 1944 production in the book you referenced.

Another question, any idea what the "-4" of the case number means?

Last but not least, this Ref. 2179 is equipped with a Hong Kong stainless steal bracelet -- any idea if this was standard issue in 1944 for some of the production run? 

Hopeful for any information. 

Sharky409

PS will post more pic's when able.  Currently this is all I got. 

identify my Omega wrist watch by its movement number only? 

Movement 10.340.023

16 Jewels

I thought in was the US ARMY Ref. CK2179 caliber 30 SC T1 or 2. But no US ARMY stamped on case back.  Inside Case Reference number is 2179 - 4. 

Now I think it is either the ref. 47 or ref. 48.  Not sure which? I can't simply measure it (30x5.1) because it is out of the house being serviced.

Can you help?

Would be great if you can. 

Sharky409

in the list.  What's up with that?

I know for sure:
 
Omega
Case Ref. 2179-4
16 Jewel
movement 10.340.023
SC
30mm diameter

It is old.

Sharky409

Omega used the code T1, T2, etc to show a 'version number' of a calibre.

i.e. the first version of the 30mm calibres was called 30.

The next updated version was called 30 T1. Then 30 T2, and so on.

There was always some small, or sometimes not so small, update to the movement when the changing from T1 to T2 to T3, etc.

grumio

thanks to Franco and grumio... very well said!

Good Hunting

Bill Sohne

That info is very interesting to me as well - so much that I have added it to my notes on 30mm series watches. 

Cheers

 

Thanks to all for info and the book ref. (Book added to Wish List.) 
I have an Omega I'm trying to get to keep time.  It loses minutes per day which ain't good (e.g. I thought I was on time for Good Friday dinner, but the wife informed me I was 15m late - I was wearing the Omega).  
Continue to address the problem - hopefully I can get it resolved.  

 

 

 

This message has been edited by Sharky409 on 2011-04-22 13:50:33

 Hello.

  Some watches work well in some positions and stop or slow, fast in other positions, make sure that your watch is working well in all positions.

  Good Luck

 

  Your watch looks like a US Army Ref 2179 with a 30T2 ?

This message has been edited by hoipolloi on 2011-04-22 14:15:20

Hi hoipolloi,

I suspect you are correct.  When I get the screw-off back screwed off I will post the numbers I find. 

NOTE:  US ARMY is not engraved on the outside of the case back of my watch - I read in numerous internet postings this common.

Inside Omega's one sees a pointer usually in the middle between the letters "A" & "R".  I surmise these are French abbreviations for "Advancement" and "Retardement", non? Can one make an adjustment here for correcting a slow/fast running Omega by moving the pointer in the appropriate direction to compensate for not keeping correct time? Or is it most prudent not to mess with the "A" & "R" adjustment pointer?

Also, can a novice apply a sparing drop of sewing machine oil somewhere to improve 30 T2 2179 operations or better not to?

Can you add any information about the watch band?  Many of the US ARMY 30 T2 2179 seem to be supplied with leather straps i.e. not a stainless steel Hong Kong bracelet as this one has. 

Just questions.

Sharky
This message has been edited by Sharky409 on 2011-04-22 16:02:22

  Hi Sharky.

  I surmise these are French abbreviations for "Advancement" and "Retardement", non?        Oui .

 Also, can a novice apply a sparing drop of sewing machine oil somewhere to improve 30 T2 2179 operations or better not to?  Non, Jamais

  The only thing you can do is to move that pointer a bit at a time then see how fast/slow it becomes.

    Right now, looks like it needs a good cleaning and you are not able to do that. You should bring it to a watch maker and have it serviced. (cleaned, oiled and adjusted).

  About the strap, you can try a leather or canvas with a plain SS buckle which costs you about 20 bucks. The US Army 2179 shouldn't have Omega logo on the crown and the buckle. I guess (too early for that)

This message has been edited by hoipolloi on 2011-04-22 16:27:18

Hey thanks hoipolloi for the advice. 

I will heed.

Will keep stainless steel.  Why not? Besides, it feels great and I like it.

Copy and comprehend crown lack of Omega marking.  This does not bother me. Some think the crown is a replacement because it does not sport the Omega logo.  (A retired watchmaker told me the crown was surely a replacement. Just goes to show anyone can make a mistake.)

Thanks again. 

Sharky

By the way, here's mine.

     

 

    No logo on that crown

Thanks for the pic. My camera will not take close in shots (too bad for me).
Your numerals seem somewhat different then mine.  What do you say to this?
When I get the back off I will (attempt to) date my 2179.  Perhaps this will explain numeral deviation?

Sharky

... has no logo on the crown or crystal, but came with an Omega leather watchband and US-market signed buckle.  

It was purchased from the family of the original owner, so I have only two explanations for this:

1. The band/buckle is original to 1946, or

2. The original owner purchased an OEM band/buckle combo at a later date.

My theory (as yet unproven) is that these watches were originally produced under a contract between Omega and the US Army specifically for the Air Corps in early 1945.  After WWII ended, some may have been later sold as war surplus or via the post exchange system. 

Didn't mean to get too far off-track, but I hope this information helps,

gatorcpa

This message has been edited by gatorcpa on 2011-04-23 11:39:57

Hi Gator.

  It's a very nice 2179 you have.

  Signed buckles or plain ? I am not sure but I assume that it happened at the same time with the crowns and  I save some money on that (signed buckles are expensive, you know)

  Now, back to the topic.

   Does anyone has any idea about the 30T1SC ? what's the differences between the T1 and T2?

 

    Best

Opened Ref. 2179 today. 

Took it to get clean, oil, and adjusted --- waiting for an estimate.
Got it open and found: 
mvt # 10.340.023 (according to the info I researched this makes it a 1944)
16 J
case # 2179-4

When able will post pic's. 

From Omega database, you can find some more info about 2179

    US Army

Gents' leather strap

Reference

CK 2179

International collection

1941

Special series
Other

Movement

• Type: Manual winding (mechanical)
• Caliber number: 30 T2 SC
• Special high precision adjustment of the movement (like a chronometer)
  16 jewels
  Central sweep-second hand

Case

Stainless steel

Case back

• Screw-in
• Full metal

Dial

Silvered, with luminous arabic hour markers (radium), "railway" minute track, "skeleton" hands and "Swiss-Made" between 5 and 7 o'clock.

Crystal

Hesalite (unbreakable)

Bracelet

Leather

Water resistance

30 meters

Case : round (29 mm dial opening), with screw-in case back
This watchstyle - based on reference 2384 - has been delivered to the "U.S.Army" in a limited quantity of 10'000 units, during spring 1945. It bears a "U.S. Army" engraving on the outside case back.
The watch is also existing in a civilian version (not chronometer though) under ref. CK 2384.
Swiss retail price (1941) : CHF 100.- (civilian version)
JLM

 

                                  

 

  I don't see a "Hong Kong stainless steal bracelet " there, only a leather strap.

 

  Best.

Hello Everyone...

I just wanted to jump in here, I have seen over the years about 2179s and 2384s as US ARMY watches.    NOT ALL 2179 ans 2384 are US ARMY.   These reference were also sold into the public markets as well.   THE US ARMY version of these references are a sub set of all 2179 and 2384 produced.   You should assume that if your watch does not have the "U.S. ARMY" light stamp on the back of the watch it is not a US ARMY watch. 

The sad part is the Omega web site is is unclear in my opinion.  Omega should simple state that this case reference was use by US ARMY and was also for sale to the general public.

In my observations over the years, all the US ARMY marked  2179 had case ref marked "2179/3 " on the inside of the caseback.   The 2384 also had a specific lot group but I do not remember it off hand.


I hope this clears up some of the questions on "US ARMY" 2179 and 2384s.... 


Good Hunting

Bill Sohne

Hi and thank you for the extra information on this Father's Day. 

Based on what you write I must go with this 30T2SC  16J  NOT being US ARMY because it does not have US ARMY stamp on the back. 

And the inside the case, Case Reference is 2179 - 4,  i.e. NOT "2179 / 3". 

The  movement number is:  10.340.023.  
(According to table I found on-line movement numbers from 10'000'000 to 11'000'000 place production between 1944 & 1947.  Is this correct - anyone know?  Can this be narrowed?)

Unfortunately the Omega bible does NOT list a Ref. CK2179 with 16 jewels, or am I missing something here?

I copy.  The Hong Kong stainless steel bracelet must be an after-market replacement improvement made or attempted by prior owner/wearer. I too like it compared to leather strap. 

Can one easily explain the differences between Reference 2179 & Reference 2384.   For example:  can Ref. 2179 be based on Ref. 2384?

I am having the watch serviced.  I was given a couple of estimates.  Anyone have ideas/thoughts on reasonable repair prices to help me out.  Are parts for these references still available? 

All feed back or comments truly welcome.

Again, thanks for the help. 

Sharky409

Hi

A few questions...  is the watch currently running ?If it is running is it running fast slow ? is it consistent ?  Do you have a photo of the movement ?   This could sort of help in guessing a typical estimate.

Ok now what book are you referencing as the Omega Bible ?

On the topic of the 2179 and the 2384...

The 2179 has a higher case profile ,  aka " its thicker on the wirst"  vs the 2384.   One was not the design basis for the other.  Once I have a little more time I will get examples of both cases and do side by side shots for for a crystal clear understanding.


Good Hunting

Bill



 

No photo of mvt.  Sorry. 

It is consistently slow.

The expensive book from the museum. 

COPY:  2179 is thicker then 2384. 

In remarks somewhere in this blog it was stated 2179 civilian version based on ref CK2384 (1941).  That is, there was a Ref 2179 civilian version produced that is NOT Ref 2179 US ARMY make/model/version. Correct? 

I am tempted to conclude I have the civilian Ref 2179, but am not sure. 

Case Ref. is 2179 - 4.
16 Jewels.
SC
30mm

Must be after-market replacement stainless steel bracelet, but not sure of this.

Can't figure out if it is T1 or T2. 

Watch is currently being serviced.  I hope parts are not a problem.

Thanks for all the help!

Sharky409

sure what the inside case reference is for the Omega Ref. 2384. Anyone know for sure? How does one determine the difference between Ref. 2179 and Ref. 2384. Sharky409

Any idea what the difference is in the 2179 & 2384? 
Does the Omega db have info. on Ref 2179 civilian model? 
Does the Omega db say anything about Case Ref. Number 2179 - 4?
Would you re-glow a vintage Omega, i.e. hands & dial points?
Grateful for any info. & thoughts.  

Sharky409

 

 _Any idea what the difference is in the 2179 & 2384?

 Bill already wrote about it, I guess, (I don't have a 2384 and don't know anything about it)

_Does the Omega db have info. on Ref 2179 civilian model? 

 No, they don't

 _Does the Omega db say anything about Case Ref. Number 2179 - 4?

   No, the number 1=2=3=4 is the batch number, I guess.

_Would you re-glow a vintage Omega, i.e. hands & dial points?

   No, I won't.

 

   Regards

I won't either, i.e. re-glow.
I am having it serviced as you recommended. 
So the "4" in the 2179 - 4 is a "batch" number.  OK.  On mine it is written 2179 - 4.  I notice it is also written often as 2179/3. 
It seems Omega has poor records for the 1940's,  Understandable I suppose.
So it seems to me my Omega wrist watch is the 30SCT216p.  (Who knows?)
What good is knowing the mvt number, anyway?

Have a great day!

Case : round (29 mm dial opening), with screw-in case back This watchstyle - based on reference 2384 - has been delivered to the "U.S.Army" in a limited quantity of 10'000 units, during spring 1945. It bears a "U.S. Army" engraving on the outside case back. The watch is also existing in a civilian version (not chronometer though) under ref. CK 2384. Swiss retail price (1941) : CHF 100.- (civilian version) JLM THANKS FOR THIS AMPLIFYING INFO. FOR ME IT GENERATES A COUPLE OF IMMEDIATE QUESTIONS. 1 WHAT DOES LINE TWO "BASED ON REFERENCE 2384" REALLY MEAN? 2 WHEN NO "US ARMY" ENGRAVING IS ON THE OUTSIDE CASE BACK - WHAT THEN? (OK I got the point it could have been polished off, but it sure doesn't look like it to me.) 3 THE WATCH IS ALSO EXISTING IN A CIVILIAN VER... (What exactly are the details of this information? If it is a Ref CK2384 is 2179-4 on the inside case?) 4 ANY INFO REGARDING MVT NUMBER WOULD SURE HELP. 5 WHO IS JLM? SHARKY409