Officine Panerai

Hi all, been lurking for a while and just got my first Pam, a 317K which I'm still over the moon about! Here's a wristshot:



Which brings me to my next point. I'm looking for a Radiomir to complement the 317. I've been reading that the Radiomirs typically wear smaller than the Luminors due to the shorter wire loops, but haven't been able to find a comparison. If you compare the strap to strap "width" on a 47mm Radiomir to a 44mm 1950 Luminor, is the Radiomir bigger? And by how much? The 1950 44mm is probably the largest Luminor that will fit on my wrist, which is a good/bad thing depending on how you look at it. Most of the ADs here have no stock, and I don't want to trouble a private dealer to show me his stuff if I'm not sure about buying.

Since I already have a black watch, I think something metallic would be nice, and suits the Radiomir look. I've shortlisted 2 Radiomirs: the 8D manual (45mm), and the 10D auto GMT (47mm). 8D manual has 3 versions, steel (268), Ti with brown dial (346) and ceramic (384). Power reserve is a must, hence only these 2 models.

Have a couple of considerations. I'm not a big fan of polished steel, because scratches show up easily (like the polished center links on the Rolex). I baby my watches and wear them usually with long sleeves, but still. Since I already have a manual, would be nice to complement with an auto, and particularly because I don't wish to wear out the crown with the constant locking/unlocking to wind. And GMT will be a useful complication for my lifestyle.

So really boils down to the 346 and 323. I like both but both have their drawbacks.

346

Pros: Brushed case, and the brown dial looks really classy
Cons: Ti (scratches more easily, though less obvious), preference for PR on the dial, manual (wear and tear on crown with need to wind, and I already have a manual)

323

Pros: GMT, auto, PR on dial (though I kinda prefer the fang)
Cons: 47mm might be too big, polished steel case

What would you do? And just to preempt the suggestion, buying both is not an option!

earlier..   The black knight is a nice watch.. Always love a pam in ceremic.

For the rad , i will go for the 323,,, 47mm ,GMT... a nice watch for formal and informal events. IMO.

Regards

John

it's really nice what you got there.. the 317 K series..

Between the 2 rad, I'd pick the 323...

The cyclops on the 346 is a major turn-off for me...

Also that I've tried and worn a 323 before, it feels really nice on the wrist..

The dial is busy, but the circular power reserve made good balance with the second hand

+ that it has what you're looking for, automatic movement and GMT function

Polished steel will of course get some harilines if you wear long sleeve shirt,

But I wouldn't be too worried about that.. It's pretty common

Good luck!


Sam

Of your choices, I would say go for the 346 - Ti with brown dial is unbeatable.

A version is great even if you don't look at the back all the time.

For the Radomir I would personnally choose the 346, I just love the Ti case.

Best regards,

George

Ciao!

First of all welcome to the club!

You'b got a very great watch there mate!

As for your 2nd one among the two that you are contemplating, i'd say go for the Titanium!

Cheers

Stephen

I know I kinda joined the 317K party late, but better late then never! Still catch myself admiring the watch every now and then instead of looking at the time. Haha...

On the Radiomir choice, thanks for the feedback. If I count my wife's opinion, it's still even. I bought her a 241, so maybe the power reserve has caught on with her. Her comment when I asked why she liked the 323 better than the 346 (and she was eager to get rid of me to go back to her reading) was "more dials".

Functionality wise the 323 wins hands down in my book, but the polished look still bothers me. Also, not that convinced I can pull off that size and real life examples are hard to come by. Learning the hard way that my wrist will not grow to fit a watch and that I will not be happy with a compromise.

I'm actually more partial towards the 346, brushed finish and it exudes class with the brown dial and Ti colour. Also, it has a clean-ish dial compared to the busy 317, which is a nice variation. The cyclops I don't really mind that much, since it's under the crystal. If I didn't have a ceramic watch already, the 384 would also be a strong contender.

Am I being paranoid about the crown wearing out on a manual with all the locking/unlocking? That's the only misgiving I have about the 346. But I would believe Panerai wouldn't put out a flawed design or use substandard components. I'm no horology expert, but I guess there would be a ton of other manual watches out there with locking crowns, and with probably shorter power reserves.

Should I be concerned about a Ti finish? Softer than steel, but I read that the finish "heals" with oxidation, and you can already touch up hairlines with a touch-up brush/ink eraser.

Some photos to help in your decision...

47mm SS goodness:  I actually really like the round PR.  Its a great piece with some useful complications.  But it sits a bit high due to the 10 Day PR Auto movement.  6.5" wrist. 

 

Here is a comparison photo of the profiles between the 346 and the 190 I took last year at the PuristS/Panerai Dinner.  (has it been a year already?)  The 346 is a bit thicker than the 190 on the bottom. 

 I don't have a good shot of the 346 but its pretty much wears the same as the 190 but a bit thicker. 

Sorry for this poor photo of the 317, 323 and partial 190. 

 

I have a few titanium watches for years now my skin is never rough enough to 'rub' any mark on the case.   Moreover, given the construction of the onion crown on the the Radiomir, you can easily wind it without rubbing your fingers against the case.

As to your ultimate choice, may I throw a curve ball by suggesting a PAM322?     Clean look, different yet equally well finished movement, matte case, brown dial, what's there NOT to like?  

So I have gone from a noob to trying to find out all I can about Panerai (with some success!).  In the process I have found my original "must haves" and cool factors going the other way so I thought I'd share this with you. 

is to TRY THE WATCHES ON.!! there's no Better way.

don't feel bad asking your Dealer to Order a few Watches for you to Check them out..

i look at it this way: if i'm Buying a Pair of Jeans on Line and if it doesn't Fit mo right ? it's no Big Deal. i'll give it to my Brother or a Friend. but when i'm Buying some Expensive Toys i Better be Sure of it.!!!

to answer your Question, yes the 47mm will wear Larger than the 44 Luminor. BUT the 190 is a Great Choice.it'll definitely wear smaller than the 47mm Rad. on the other hand, the 323 a lot.. again, you have to Try them on and see which Suits you Best..

 Good Luck.

 Tony

Best way is to try to be sure. I'm not even ordering from the ADs here, as they're likely not to have any stock. Left a note to be informed of new stock for a 317 and 335 2 months ago, and until now have heard nothing. Something peculiar that the local AD told me was that Panerai in Singapore does not allow orders on specific models. They'll dump a batch of watches, and the ADs either take all or nothing. Not sure how much truth there is to that or if it's a local market phenomenon. I've been sourcing my stuff through a grey dealer, and unfortunately he's unable to get the 323 at the moment. The 346 however, is available. Still wondering if I should wait...

Radiomir, auto, PR on dial with fangs, busy dial (like the 317) 45mm...seems to have most of stuff you're looking for....

Cheers - Sergio

Which does not rank highly in my book. Thanks Sergio, I did think about that one. It's a manual BTW, shares almost the same movement as the 346, and hence the 346 is its closest comparison. Between the 2 I'd rather the 346. The 323 is also polished steel, but has quite a bit of complications on the dial, and I'm a complicated guy.

in my old age dislexia accompanies me.. I noticed the polished steel preference but hey, since you're not going to find THE thing, one "contra" instead of more, not a bad deal. The manual "contra" would be minimal being an 8 days PR piece. Complicated it's perfect for me, so long as it's someone else and not me... I have enjoyed the....arrogantly simple...for most of my life.

Cheers - Sergio

I might get there given time. For now I enjoy complicated.=)

Thank you! That's a really nice 323! I could take a ruler to the screen to be sure, but it looks like the distance between the extremes of the lugs on the 335, 339 and 323 all seem to about the same. In fact, looks like the 335 is just a tad larger than the other 2 47mm Rads. Do you guys agree with that assessment?

Would those happen to be your watches so I can trouble you to prop them up resting on the lugs?

Case thickness is not really a problem for me, and by now I'm pretty used to bringing my shirts back to the tailor batch by batch to get the left cuffs widened. Just don't want the width of the watch to overhang my wrist, which looks odd.

Actually the 335 was a close second to the 317 when I was deciding which Pam to start with. It shares the same number designation as an iconic Gibson guitar which I like a lot. The PVD movement and complications eventually won.

Back to the Rads, my grey dealer can't locate a 323 but has a 346 in stock. Should I wait? I could try out his 339 to be sure of the fit, but if the 323 is not available...

- Luke

I own the 190 and the 249.  The photos were taken at the PuristS Panerai event last year.  Sorry, I mistaken the 335 for your 317. 

In general, luminors wear big.  I have 6.5" wrist and I am comfortable with a 47mm Rad.  But I am on the fence with a 47mm Luminor. 

This is the best I can do if you are looking for some idea of the difference between the 47mm and the 45mm Rads..

 

Good luck!

No worries Phil, thanks very much for the help!

the black croc on the Cali...

Cheers - Sergio

here you go...45mm Titanium brushed goodnes:

47mm:  339 composite..

What's the difference between the "contemporary" and "historic" Radiomirs? Is there a marked case difference like the 1950 Luminors or it is a designation with reference to the complications?

I believe the Historic models are typically handwound with ETA / 3day / 8day movements.  The contemporary models are automatics with some complications. 

I'm not a fan of polished watches either, but I make exceptions for Radiomirs.  Why?  Because I feel Radiomirs looks best when the cases are polished, not brushed or bead blast finished, because the Rad case is an elegant sporty dress watch IMO. 

With the curves of the Radiomir case, I feel you get to appreciate and see all the beautiful lines more easily when the case is polished.

Cheers,
Anthony

All of you raise valid points. I'm kinda leaning towards the Ti version now though. Clean dial will be a nice variation from the busy 317, and the PR on the back is not a big deal (as opposed to no PR).

On the 322, it's a 47mm, so the size may be a deal breaker, and the power reserve is lower at 3 days or so. Lastly the price!

One question on Ti, another scary thing I've read elsewhere is that Ti surfaces could "fuse" if untouched for a while. The crown is likely to be used regularly since it's a manual and it will be worn, thing is the case back is also Ti and that could be a problem. Should that be cause for concern? I would think Panerai wouldn't put out something that could be problematic, but curious to hear what you think.

So after a long while of inaction, I finally settled on this:



Quite an overlap with the Luminor, but I just couldn't resist when my dealer had one. Got an Assolutamente strap like the 292 owners recommended, and it looks better than with the stock strap!

Question though. When I was changing the straps myself I noticed the wire loops on the buckle side had a short metal tube attached to one wire loop, sorta to hold the wire loops together in the strap, when I pulled them out of the strap. Strange thing when I was expecting to see the same tube on the long strap side, no tube! Looked in the old straps' ends, didn't see anything, and the new straps didn't have anything either. Is this normal?