Patek Philippe

Patek's quality control has had some issues. The following is a video from a Hong Kong showing a brand new 5711/1R and a 5711/1A olive dial with scratches all over the hour markers especially in the latter. Start at around 3:25 and one would be shocked by the many scratches. If true, such issues might suggest that Mr. Stern's efforts to build a huge manufactory comes at the cost to high quality watchmaking.  This message has been edited by GLau on 2021-07-06 12:42:10 This message has been edited by GLau on 2021-07-06 12:51:51

…into ensuring top quality watchmaking. One would think that with the skewed popularity of nautilus and aquanauts while that of its other leather strap models are only lukewarm, the brand would put more sincere efforts to better watchmaking and innovation. Instead, it continues to churn out poor quality pieces where other brands with similar materials and configurations are selling at a fraction of its price but at much higher quality (such as Rolex).

“Instead, it continues to churn out poor quality pieces” 

in addition to the video, also presented what I and other of my collector friends had experienced. Any and all brands may have imperfect products, but even disregarding what's in the video, there are more incidents that one would expect from Patek, hence the comment about poor quality pieces. Mr. Sam Wan's 5370P is a prime example. I still love the brand and continue to purchase its pieces, but since the incident with my 5370P along with others like that of my friend whose caseback completely fell off from the watch upon cutting the plastic bag exposing the movement, I am a lot more cautious and inspect the pieces under a high mag loupe at the time of acquisition. 

“there are more incidents that one would expect from Patek”
Here’s a fact...
In 2018 Patek Philippe made 62,000 watches involving human assembly.

including how they "deal with customers", and ensuring high standard QC is part of that 

alerting us to some QC issues.

Understandably Sam and you are disappointed about the problems you two had. The community is genuinely focused with such matters faced by our members. We all want what you and Sam want: better QC and improved after sale service.

In my and others’ experiences, Patek most likely fixed QC issues to our satisfaction. With such after sales service for 50/60k watches a year, perhaps the tag line of this post could be more friendly/balanced, such as “How can we help to improve Patek’s QC issue” ?

Thank you for your suggestions.

I can sense your Patek passion and want Patek to improve👍

Having had dust first hand (visible to naked eye) with several recent Tudors from ADs, I am not at all surprised. Also heard similar stories second hand from GS.

the authenticity of the watches in the video, I can say that if the scratches are real, it is not a surprise to me. I’ve collected Pateks for over 20 years, and what I have seen over the last 10 years are shocking. My 5370P’s seconds hand was stuck and stopped moving a couple of mins thx after purchase. Look at another post in this forum of a 5370P with oil leak to the dial belonging to a well known collector.

Now your argument involves the “oil leak” on the 5370 dial of another member...are you at least sure that was an oil leak?? Have you spoken to him? As far as I can tell, neither this member nor Patek have confirmed that so far.

As I stated, I cannot vouch for the authenticity of the pieces in the video and thanks for your warning regarding that. I've also described my unpleasant experience with my 5370P, as well as that of my friend's brand new watch's caseback that completely fell off upon cutting its plastic bag, and that of Mr. Sam Wan's, be it oil leak or not. These are quite serious issues. My love towards the brand remains, and I am always thankful to my AD who allocates me with the latest pieces. It is exactly for my love of the brand that I wish similar negative issues could be minimized. The video was shared to raise such a concern and I for one now always take a close look at my allocated pieces with a loupe for any issues, rather than simply being overwhelmed with joy with the allocation and quickly paid and left without a detailed inspection as I did in the past.

Is likely genuine, sold by VIPStation in Hong Kong which is pretty famous for flipping items at high price but never had complains of counterfeit products. I even knew it went for approx HK2.5mn.
So instead of reflecting on the poor quality of the watch (honestly I wouldn't accept this kind of flaw on a tudor let alone patek) I see patek lovers trying to dismiss the authenticity of the watch. That is pretty disappointing
Adding to the fact the new calibres decidedly skimp on quality and I only see people defending this as well - it's telling where Patek is heading.

Is magnified, imperfections” are bound to appear. Good thing my eyes views things as Monets! 😂

Pretty disappointing to see a Patek supporter ignoring blatant flaws and use the authenticity card. It's telling ofnthe quality of the watch and the supporters

Authenticity of the video has not been independently verified. Each of us can have a view on its authenticity. Unless and until genuine proof can be provided, let’s respect each other’s opinion. Furthermore, please refrain from making aggressive comments such as “ignoring blatant flaws”.
Please PM me if your have questions.

If you do, you’ll understand. This video just show close up on parts of a watch, not convincing to me. I like to see the whole picture that this is an authentic watch with papers, movement numbers etc first then go into the story….but of course, all these can be fake nowadays.

…in my opinion. They can afford to be since they have such a large brand recognition.

Is that meant to be a joke?
They can afford to provide lower quality than their competitors because of their higher brand recognition?
I would argue the exact opposite. When you have a bigger brand name, you have more to lose and therefore you can’t afford to provide lower quality. Nothing gets lost quicker than a good reputation…

Just my opinion, though. Reasonable minds can differ. Here is the back of my VC 82172. The movement is is finished to the highest levels. It includes inside and outside corners in the anglage. Perfect concentric tracing around the escapement wheel jewel. Shallow, perfect cote de geneve. The case back has crisp engravings and nice surface treatments. And the movement and case meet the seal of geneva.



And here is the front of it.



The dial furniture is perfectly polished and aligned. The dial has an applied gold logo. The hands are flawless including the transition down the center. And the dial is decorated with graining and tracks and marks which shift with the light. The Vacheron is truly a feast for the eyes and is finished to the highest level. A comparably priced 5119 would be a few steps behind in terms of quality and finishing, IMO. And even the new 6119 which has a ~50% price premium, comes close to meeting the Vacheron on the dial side. But it still lacks things like inside corners on the anglage on the movement. Also, the lack of the geneva seal on the Patek was a big deal for me when I was contemplating the purchase of the 82172 and considering other options. I think Patek would improve quality or perception of it by resubmitting to the geneva seal.

Look at AP, the stronger the hype the more corners are cut and cost savings are captured. The stronger the brand, the more the brand itself drives the ship than the actual products.

That said, I have no opinion on VC vs PP 😉

I had the fortune to be invited to visit the PP manufactory in Plan-les-Ouates in Geneva before the final buildings were fully completed. A lovely place and Mr. Stern's vision and ambition was clearly witnessed. However, the suboptimal quality control is nothing new. "Patekcollector" has long in IG made statements on that. Aside from what was shown in the video which some readers here may find it hard to believe, had one been following the many issues with Patek watches, there are many other example which collectors had posted including Mr. Sam Wan's 5370P in another post, my 5370P's malfunctioned second hand which got stuck and would not advance, scratches in the movements in other posts, and even the case back of a brand new watch upon cutting its seal fell off from the watch at the AD, one would be inclined to believe and agree that Patek needs to really tighten up its laxed quality control. The high costs incurred with building the mecca in Geneva should not be at the expense of high quality. I am not surprised by those scratches shown in the video at all, it's just that the demand for nautilus and aquanauts are so high that even with these "imperfections", many are willing to ignore them. And now with the pandemic where dealers are finding it difficult to sell their strap models, many dealers here are cautiously hinting that in order that they could acquire the sports models, they will have to bundle the purchase with those pieces which are in less demand.