Paul Riders
1
Covered ground
Movements constructed with similiar characteristics will certainly look alike. The movement diameter and classic going-train found in both of these movements yields to a predictable similar layout. Add to this, the positioning of the balance and the barrel found in both of these movements are just about spoken for when you incorporate 6 o'clock subseconds and a winder at 3 o'clock . As well, similar positions of the pinions and wheels in the going-train are just common sense (as these are positioned in the most efficient way). Once all of this is decided - there are only so many ways to attach the bridges (and the screws on them) to the base plate.
In short, there are just so many ways to layout the mechanics on a 3-hand watch. This particular design from JLC is known for its robustness and functionality, as I'm sure Mr. Dufour's work also incorporates.
Have you ever heard about the argument between the 2 preachers, about which came first - the hen or the egg (a metaphor for God or the universe). It does a fine job of illustrating the purportless back-and-forth comments in regards to which is the first, which is the best, etc. Both movements are a fine testament to horology - enjoy them both for what they are and appreciate them for the two different creations that they have been rendered for.
Paul
Simplicity really a JLC?
It's come to my attention that Dufour's Simplicity is based on a vintage JLC calibre. I have this information on good authority. Do any of you know the whole story? ===== Added to Editor's Pick -Anthony This message has been edited by AnthonyTsai on 2007-...
I have heard this a lot, however, as a very qualified watchmaking
authority once told me, many mechanical watches have similarities. I mean they all have springs, jewels, barrels, plates, and escapements. Kind of like people, if you get enough of them, some will look the same. So although I do not know for sure, and hav...
Not meaning to be unkind...
...but I always have a problem with phrases such as "..I have it on good authority that...", or "... according to a source close to the President... " or " ... a good friend who wishes to remain anonymous... ". Please excuse me: it's my problem, not yours...
If it is a JLC , you will see legal officers from JLC
coming after Mr Dufour long ago Usually this kind of statement comes from non-watchmaker 'authority' if you know what I mean. Jasny is correct to point out that since Mr Dufour wants to make a really simple , classic watch that can last, how many configur...
Covered ground
Movements constructed with similiar characteristics will certainly look alike. The movement diameter and classic going-train found in both of these movements yields to a predictable similar layout. Add to this, the positioning of the balance and the barre...
Even more...
If I remember correctly Mr. Dufour also explicitly has design elements and decoration elements that are typical from the la Vallée du Joux watchmaking tradition in his watches. As JLC is and has been one of the major manufacturers in just this region it w...
As many others have mentioned, if you are speaking of
overall movement layout and proportions and certain stylistic elements, then perhaps, but no more so than both are based upon earlier designs from the same schools. Also specifically, I am not aware of any 30mm JLC wristwatch movements, and this is what M...
this all started as a joke when someone posted on another site a morphed
scan of the Simplicity movement which morphed into a vintage JLC movement, it was just for fun and not to be taken seriously, even more when you consider that the two movements didn't really have much in common...
Good joke...
...but I'm curious when you say " ...even more when you consider that the two movements didn't really have much in common.." Best regards Suitbert
But Alex, you as an Expert....
...you surely know that the "shape of bridges" is something which is often changed, while keeping the inner bits and the basic going train. Something like all the different variations of Unitas (now ETA) 6497/98 , in a Dornblüth with 3/4 plate for example...
I'm no expert Suitbert but if Dufour is using a vintage JLC movement he
has made so many modifications to it that it doesn't look like a JLC movement any more!
I may have misunderstood the whole thread....
Hi Alex, ...but as I read it, the question raised was more "that it's possibly "based" or "derived" from a JLC movement. I think there's little doubt that the work is exquisite and very elaborate - and going in detail as far as only very few others ever d...
The way I understood the question was that the Simplicity was based on a vintage
JLC caliber. i guess "based" can be interpreted in different ways: based as in using an ebauche or based as in insprired from. I was trying to point out that this whole thing started from felipe posting a fun post with the Simplicity movement morphing int...
I'm not going to start .....
...semanthic level - considering my level of english that wouldn't be good Just to get an idea of your point of view, how'd you consider the IWC Ingenieur caliber than(using large part of the 7750 going train, keyless works....., but different plate and b...
Dear Suitbert....sorry to be confuse in this dialogue.
I have tremendous respect of Alex and your views. Very interesting to me and I'm sure to many others. So in your point of view, would you consider the Dufour Simplicity similar from the vintage JLC? From my vague recollection, Mr Dufour did do the Duality...
Suitbert do you have any first hand knowledge on the fact that
the movement is is either based on or used parts from a JLC ebauche? because I have a slight feeling that you are beating around the bush All I know is that the balances and springs are NOS which Dufour acquired. Regarding your question as for up to what ...
I hit the post button too fast! To further continue
I personnally don't really care if the movement is in fact a JLC ebauche because what's important to me is not cutting the plates and bridges but what you do to them and what Dufour does for me is fantastic. Let's take Voutilainen for example, he uses a P...
Hello, Alex, I'll try to answer...
..."first hand knowledge"...? No, not in the sense of that I would be among the lucky owners, for example. But when I visited PPhilippe Dufour's workshop years back I had the opportunity to see some details - and, as I'm more the tech interested watch guy...
So to put it briefly, the answer to the question on hand is most likely a "Yes"
thanks for the animated pic Suitbert cheers, anthony
Much ado about nothing....
I recall seeing the "morphing" photo of the JLC and Dufour movements. As others have stated it was a joke and not to be taken seriously. I can't recall if the JLC movement had brass plates, but if it does then that puts to rest the notion that Dufour is r...